STAKE F1 TEAM KICK SAUBER

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Aty
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STAKE F1 TEAM KICK SAUBER

#1

Post by Aty »

http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/ ... 1_project/

Lovely rumors deserve a new thread.
  • The plan is to buy Sauber,” said correspondent Andrea Cremonesi. “Audi has clear ideas and is proceeding with a series of investments. The Neuburg headquarters will see new buildings added in the coming months.

    “Audi is not interested in simply being a power unit supplier,” said Cremonesi. “It wants to influence the team’s choices.”
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D/T 2023.02.10 - 06:07 (CET) . Chage of thread title to better reflect upon current team configuration.
Last edited by Aty 2 months ago, edited 18 times in total.
Aty
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#2

Post by Aty »

Sauber hints at announcement of deal with Audi for Singapore GP
https://www.gpblog.com/en/news/138260/s ... re-gp.html
Sweet (if true). GPBlog however made similar predictions in the past. I do hope they are on the ball this time.
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#3

Post by Aty »

F1 news:
Red Bull team boss Christian Horner has welcomed Audi as a future F1 power unit supplier, describing confirmation of the German manufacturer’s 2026 entry as “significant” for the sport.
Great orator in now almost daily commenting on Porsche and Audi. I guess he can't help himself. Maybe he has an inside line on negotiations, who knows.

In contrast to him, I hope Audi will enter as a team owner with their first job to take RBR a peg down in the constructor's championship. Audi needs to take full control of the development, body and PU. Anything else is risky and makes no sense.

Admittedly it might be difficult on WDC side. Max is unbeatable. We might find out soon what the deal is with them. When Peter Sauber sold his team, one of the conditions of sale was for new owners to keep the team in Hinwil, Zürich, Switzerland. Audi however wants their team in Germany. Hard to say if this all makes any difference. Waiting continues.
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#4

Post by Everso Biggyballies »

Aty wrote: 1 year ago F1 news:
Red Bull team boss Christian Horner has welcomed Audi as a future F1 power unit supplier, describing confirmation of the German manufacturer’s 2026 entry as “significant” for the sport.
Great orator in now almost daily commenting on Porsche and Audi. I guess he can't help himself. Maybe he has an inside line on negotiations, who knows.

In contrast to him, I hope Audi will enter as a team owner with their first job to take RBR a peg down in the constructor's championship. Admittedly it might be difficult on WDC side. Max is unbeatable. We might find out soon what the deal is with them. When Peter Sauber sold his team, one of the conditions of sale was for new owners to keep the team in Hinwil, Zürich, Switzerland. Audi however wants their team in Germany. Hard to say if this all makes any difference. Waiting continues.
If they are buying Sauber the one thing they will want is the Sauber wind tunnel which is still considered as the benchmark.

Hinwil is maybe 350 klms from Ingolstadt, the Audi Motorsport base.

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#5

Post by Aty »

Future deployment of wind tunnel is in doubt. I am aware that AM is also building one, however FiA is known to propagate limited use of WT.
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#6

Post by Everso Biggyballies »

Aty wrote: 1 year ago Future deployment of wind tunnel is in doubt. I am aware that AM is also building one, however FiA is known to propagate limited use of WT.
All the teams (bar Haas who have access to Ferrari's WT) have a wind tunnel. With limited hours surely to have the best wind tunnel is of major importance.... to make best use of the limited hours available.

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#7

Post by Aty »

Everso Biggyballies wrote: 1 year ago
Aty wrote: 1 year ago Future deployment of wind tunnel is in doubt. I am aware that AM is also building one, however FiA is known to propagate limited use of WT.
All the teams (bar Haas who have access to Ferrari's WT) have a wind tunnel. With limited hours surely to have the best wind tunnel is of major importance.... to make best use of the limited hours available.
True, but... Thinking about a good WT and having one could be two different scenarios. VAG should built a one of their.

It has taken (I cannot recall the exact time) Ferrari about 18(?) months or more before they had found their WT miscalibrated. Honda had suffered a similar problem with their PU dyno. It took Honda over a year before they identified why lab results were so much different from results on the track.

This lack of on track testing and allowing for proper engineering work is a pain in that unmentionable place. I don't understand where the intended savings are if teams have to use racing time as a lab. McLaren was doing that (Alonso admitted).
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#8

Post by Aty »

Alfa Romeo CEO insists they will only ever use Ferrari engines in Formula 1
So much for the announcement Audi is buying Sauber.
Continental Europe needs their own mfg series.

- but, for now -

Audi is recruiting.
https://racingnews365.com/exclusive-aud ... o-enter-f1

This is really a puzzle.
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#9

Post by DoubleFart »

This was always really confusing for me as well. I didn't understand how Audi would take on the sponsorship/ownership of Sauber, and run as a Audi-Ferrari, Audi-Honda or Audi-Renault. It doesn't make any sense.
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#10

Post by Everso Biggyballies »

Aty wrote: 1 year ago
Alfa Romeo CEO insists they will only ever use Ferrari engines in Formula 1
So much for the announcement Audi is buying Sauber.

This is really a puzzle.
Alfa Romeo do not have any shareholding or ownership in / of Sauber. Zero percent.

The team is only called Alfa Romeo by commercial arrangement. Alfa pay Sauber a lot of money for the team to be called Alfa and be liveried as such.

Alfa long ago (within hours of the first whisper of Audi taking over Sauber) confirmed that they were not renewing the arrangement with Sauber and thus would be quitting F1 at the end of 2023 when the current contract expires..

Alfa has since confirmed they have no current future plans within F1 if any. What they said was that IF they were to be involved with a team in F1 again it would have to be a team powered by Ferrari enginesi. ie in the current engine suppliers arrangements it would mean Haas.

However they (Alfa) have said that their continuation in Motor Sport might not be within F1.... it might be in LMdH or WEC, it might be Formula E in line with their move to electric cars.

There is no mystery. There will be no Alfa connection to Sauber long before Audi join F1 Alfa Romeo as an F1 entity will not exist beyond next year when their current contract expires.

It has been on the cards that Alfa and Sauber would split for a couple of years now as Alfa have been extending their Sauber agreement for a year at a time every year since their initial agreement was made. By 2024 Sauber will either have another arrangement in place or they will revert to being Sauber.

Alfa and Sauber's arrangement is similar to the Stroll and Aston Martin arrangement.
Its just that there Stroll is the major shareholder and Chairman of both companies. Aston Martin themselves to not own the F1 team or any part of it. The team owned by Stroll (formerly known as Racing Point) have a commercial arrangement with Aston Martin to be called Aston.
Last edited by Everso Biggyballies 1 year ago, edited 1 time in total.

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#11

Post by DoubleFart »

EB, are you thinking that the team will revert back to Sauber for 2024-2025, and then full Audi branding for 2026?
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#12

Post by Aty »

Sauber (or AR) will use Ferrari engines until 2026.
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#13

Post by Everso Biggyballies »

DoubleFart wrote: 1 year ago EB, are you thinking that the team will revert back to Sauber for 2024-2025, and then full Audi branding for 2026?
Unless something else short term comes in. I guess what happens with Audi will dictate that. Basically I have no idea.... all I know is it wont remain as Alfa Romeo after end 2023 from the way Alfa have said recently.

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#14

Post by Aty »

Wolff on loosing staff to Audi:
Wolff reveals Audi barrier to hiring
Audi has already confirmed its operation will be based in Germany, and Wolff sees this as a potentially limiting factor should anybody wish to move.
http://www.f1reader.com/news/wolff-make ... ibe-330571
The positive side of his concern is the selection and development of personnel who live here. Mr. Torger might be correct in his assertion, but he can sleep well. His people will either stay or get lured away by RBR or AM. Not that much by VAG. I am still uncertain whether I understand Audi's plans, as those, despite all speculations, have not been stated, other than - we plan to get involved. I am also interested in the decision Andreas Seidl will make. Audi might be a welcoming place for him (should they decide to build a team). Audi most likely have their list of names, next to Andreas, Jost Capito, Mike Krack,..
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#15

Post by Aty »

Well, it is Adam Baker (at least for now).
Image

Audi's communications department cast some light on their thoughts and offers the most encompassing and revealing statement on their planned involvement in the sport:
https://www.audi-mediacenter.com/en/formula-1-14842
Pleasing news.
Looks much bigger dream than just an engine:
Image
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